Thailand vs Malaysia for Retirement

rogerluli, on 2009-03-04 09:55:09, said:

Perhaps getting off topic here - but Thailand in particular may not meet your desire to find something 'dependable' and to avoid visa runs. It's possible of course, but may not be easy. Malaysia offers a more attractive (easier to meet requirements) retirement visa programme I believe, although it is fair to say that probably less foreigners seem to want to retire there...

I am not near to retirement age so this is not something I have researched in any detail - in other words, get a second opinion!

CC

Captain Chaos, on 2009-03-04 18:44:13, said:

Easier? The only difference I see, is the time they offer you...5 years, and can be extended and in future even 10 years retirement visa are now under consideration. But otherwise?
You need deposit, same as in Thailand, you you might buy a house/land and not only condominium, but this must be a first category housing, not everything. As an expat you might bring with you a maid or servant included in your visa. But what else?

Dunno - haven't researched it - not near retirement age and as MrsCC is Thai, we don't really care, it will be Thailand, Australia, or the UK in that order...

To put it another way - we just don't give a s### Yohan

CC

If you picked a nice spot with good air connections, for example Penang, you could take a break to anywhere you wanted in SE Asia fairly easily anyway. Certainly Malaysia is the less xenophobic of the two countries.

I've split this into a new topic as I think it makes an interesting thread of it's own.

Stocky, on 2009-03-05 07:42:49, said:

Except for the incredibly rude Indian street vendors in Penang!

The funny-interesting point is however, these Indians have all what you need and are always the cheapest...

I tried to change money, asking around, the Indian 'office' was a table, a mobile phone and a box under the desk...
remarkable exchange difference, about 15 percent more for the yen than anywhere else.

Rent-a-car, was expensive at Avis and their cars in Penang are known to be in bad condition, the Indian guy brought me a car, which was 30 percent cheaper for rent and 50 percent stronger engine...

I asked the hotels around for a motorcycle, no, not the small ones... not available, the Indian guy in his little dirty box arranged one within 15 minutes, Honda, 400cc motor...

While some of them are indeed unfriendly and rude, they get soooo polite, when they see some business, and believe it or not, all of them were ALWAYS the cheapest - and I like Indian food and again, this little restaurant was the cheapest with a biggest meat in curry I ever have seen. Not to mention the Indian tailor everywhere, worldwide obviously.

The only what I did not accept, was the cheap Indian offer for nightlife in Penang... sorry, I do not need Indian ladyboys in my hotelroom.

Mandrunk, on 2009-03-05 10:00:19, said:

To compare Malaysia and Thailand is one of the never-ending topics. Both offer retirement visa.
The huge majority of applicants however want to stay in Thailand.

There are some pro and contra about Malaysia, maybe more contra...

There are reasons for that. In Malaysia you need somewhat more money and there is less entertainment, less personal contact with the local people. In Malaysia I think, you really MUST drive your own car, due to little public traffic.
Not much to buy there in supermarkets, few people around. Not possible to buy CHEAP condominiums as you might do in Thailand, but only upper class condominiums (but you also can buy houses and land in Malaysia as a foreigner, but very little selection), Malaysia is getting boring soon, or you must be a golf-freak. Just some thoughts.

My only point of reference here is China not having visited Thailand or Malaysia. So let me ask for some comparisons...

In China all services are very cheap - massages, haircuts/dressing, cleaning services, work done on your residence, etc. My perception is that both Malaysia and Thailand share this low cost factor for getting things done for you.

In China buying a free-standing house (a villa in Chinese parlance) is very expensive relative to condos because land is quite pricey. In Thailand and Malaysia it seems actually cheaper per sq ft. to buy a house than a condo except for the priciest areas.

One bothersome thing I have read about in relation to Malysia is the inability to easily just walk around in a city. Accounts of George Town in Penang make it sound as if you are taking your life in your hands to attempt a simple urban stroll since there are no provisions for pedestrians. China's cities, from the smallest to the largest, have outstanding facilites for pedestrians to get about. Thailand?

Public Transport...It is very simple to travel anywhere in China by air, train, bus or private car and driver rentals...

Food...Obviously great Chinese food is to be had in China...Thailand? It seems that Malaysia does have very good Chinese food in the larger cities.

rogerluli, on 2009-03-07 10:28:26, said:

In the rural areas walking is no problem, but the highways are shoddy. Driving can be like a video game dodging pot holes in the asphalt.

The roads and sidewalks in Bangkok are completely fukced up. They are in a perpetual state of repair. Sukhumvit Road, a main tourist strip has broken curbs, huge holes in the pavements, open sewer drains, re-bar sticking straight out at eye level from walls and power poles, masses of electrical wires hanging about, and stacks of broken tile and concrete blocking pedestrians from walking. These instances are a regular occurrence around the whole city. The main problem is that the substrate is a soft, sandy silt that keeps shifting and sinking, so the workmen can never keep up with the crumbling and cracking concrete. It is a dream come true for a city maintenance council because the budget is unlimited and wide open for 'skimming the pot'.

Walking down the sidewalk in Yuxi, Yunnan...


...and Qionghai, Hainan, our other apartment.

Those pictures look nice. I've never been to China, but it has always appeared to be a country where many people walk or ride bikes. Thailand has, for the most part, been a car culture. If you're riding a motorcycle, you're low class (lo-so), if you're riding a bicycle, you must be a maid servant or a migrant worker, and if you're walking, you're either pond scum or a western tourist.
It is a the most walker unfriendly country I've ever been to. The car is king.

mbk, on 2009-03-09 09:25:57, said:

Remembering this thread, I snapped this picture in Chiang Rai this afternoon... you can see similar examples on every street in every town and city across Thailand. I don't know if there are regulations to prevent this sort of mindless construction... but they're sure not enforced...

 DSC01165.JPG (151.74K)
Number of downloads: 27

I was about to go to sleep and logged out, but then I saw this photo. This is endemic in Thailand. It is almost certain that the company who put the phone box there is not at fault, but the owners of the building who have encroached on the sidewalk.
This same situation is rampant in the Ramkhamhaeng area. Just this evening I was riding my bicycle home and there were several plastic bags of garbage piled on the road side during heavy traffic. I was pinched between the garbage bags and a bus, so I just plowed right through the garbage bags. f### the Pikeys. They're f**ing all over the world.

rogerluli, on 2009-03-07 10:28:26, said:

The thing about China though... How easy is it for a foreigner to get the paperwork to actually live there?

I loved it in China when I was there, but it seems like even getting the 3 month visa to visit was a huge hassle.

China really only wants foreigners when they are needed to work there and of course spend money traveling...Other than that they prefer keeping their society closed...

mbk, on 2009-03-10 00:47:25, said:

BTW, the building pictured above is the brand new Chiang Rai HQ of Thai Airways... and the 'national carrier' obviously felt entitled to maximise their wall garden

Obviously much better value for money than wasting it on upgrading their regional / domestic fleet!

I'm doing some research just now for some Malaysia static content on OE... I have to say that taxation there looks VERY favourable... no inheritance tax, no capital gains tax on your property, tax free automobiles for people choosing to settle there etc etc... it even seems pretty easy to get Malaysian citizenship...

Have I had too much coffee today and my eyes are playing tricks on me?

Mandrunk, on 10 June 2009 - 07:19 PM, said:

Yes and No,
if you look at all and everything carefully, you will notice all is true, but it is considerably expensive.

For example, you might buy in Thailand ANY condominium as foreigner, even a very cheap one, but in Malaysia you MUST buy upper-class housing.

And in Malaysia you MUST regulate health insurances for yourself and anybody living with you, and you MUST prove a considerable income from overseas. And you MUST keep a deposit etc. etc.
You also must have a sponsor-company and pay for that.

IF you have that all together (and some Chinese from mainland China have that, and some rich Indian have that, and some Arabs can pay for that easily) then you are welcome and conditions are not bad at all.

It's good for Chinese from mainland China, as Chinese it is difficult to get visa for longstay overseas.
Same with Indians - I do not think, it is really such a good choice for Western foreigners, it's also not a bad choice..

It's 50/50.

I was studying that question many times, but finally I have to admit, living costs are remarkable cheaper in Thailand than in Malaysia (all in all, do not compare just Curry or some Chinese medicine etc.) - life is just nicer and cheaper in Thailand despite all this government chaos there.

yohan, on 10 June 2009 - 11:14 PM, said:

Is "ANY" correct? I thought that it was limited to the "tourist" areas such as Pattaya, Bangkok, Phuket, Hua Hin etc.

Can a foreigner buy a condo out in Nakhon Nowhere?

Some information regarding changes in the MM2H.

Effective 9 January, 2009 foreign citizens may apply to participate in MM2H programme directly, without going through any other third party.

In line with the Immigration Circular No. 6 of 2009, the following improvements have been made to the Malaysia My Second Home (MM2H) Programme, with effect from 13 February 2009:

1. Qualified MM2H participants aged 50 and above with specialised skills and expertise that are required in the critical sectors of the economy, are allowed to work not more than 20 hours per week.

2. MM2H participants are allowed to invest and actively participate in business, subject to existing Government policies, regulations and guidelines which are in force for the relevant sectors.

3. Foreign spouses of Malaysian nationals are eligible to apply for MM2H, subject to the terms and conditions of the MM2H programme. Alternatively, they have the option to apply for the Spouse Programme.

4. The ten-year Social Visit Pass is extended to all Silver Hair and MM2H participants who were previously approved under the five-year Social Visit Pass, subject to the validity of their passports.

5. Employment Pass holders who wish to participate in the MM2H programme are exempted from the “cooling off period” on the condition that their application to participate in MM2H programme is submitted 3 months before the expiry of the Employment Pass.

6. ID-Cards will be issued to MM2H participants with permanent address in Malaysia. This is validated by submitting the Sales and Purchase Agreement or Tenancy Agreement in Malaysia.

7. Age limit of unmarried dependent children is raised from 18 years to 21 years. A declaration stating that the child is unmarried and all expenses during the stay in Malaysia will be borne by the principal participant of the MM2H program is required.

8. ‘Dependants’ include unmarried children aged 21 years and below, step-children, disabled children and parents.