Posted 21 February 2012 - 06:00 PM
Posted 22 February 2012 - 12:38 AM
You didn't mention the most important factors... Lower expectations, and the strong family network. Where Europeans are somehow expected to leave the parental home and fight it out on their own with their own mortgage + lonely island lifestyle, this is not the case in Thailand. 10,000 Baht per month will do nicely when you're living in your room at your parent's house, with two other siblings, mum, dad, gramdma, auntie, all chipping into the pool, backing eachother up, paying the bills... and you don't have high expectations e.g. your own 60 inch plasma telly and an expensive love of Fabergé Eggs.
This is why the most successful families in British society these days are probably those of Indian descent. They brought with them their family ethics, live under the same roof, pool their resources... The money never leaves the family (unlike so many honkies that blow the cash on private rental accommodation i.e. lining someone else's pocket). They are also far more ready to help other family members in times of financial crisis. They are wealthier, closer knit families as a result.
... but this is staying off topic.
Posted 22 February 2012 - 03:03 AM
Posted 22 February 2012 - 03:36 AM
Not really so much off topic, as a fact, these always coming up discussions about Asian women, Western men, living standards, where to live, children, how much money you need, how to earn this money, support from family members in case of problems etc. concerning cross-cultural relationship are all somehow related to each other.
You cannot talk only about A without mentioning B.
Posted 22 February 2012 - 05:36 AM
I have met many Thai women who after "grabbing the brass ring" from the merry-go-round, aka "catching a foreign husband"; ended up going to live in the husbands country. They were totally isolated, without a friend other than her husband, had no common connection with the people or culture they were living around. It can change 'em very fast. It can also influence their decisions to associate with ANY person of similar nationality (whether they'd be friends with them in Thailand or not) simply because they're Thai too. The number of Thai women I've met who; had foreign husbands, went to their country, lived for a while, returned to Thailand and were left with a “bad taste in their mouth" about living overseas is a significant number.
If your wife doesn't speak the language of what ever country you're gonna live in, she's gonna be WAY outta her element when she washes up on the shores there. She should possess the language at least enough to be able to do things on her own, without you being her "shadow" or having to act as a translator for her all the time. That tends to wear thin on both people really fast.
While some people have criticized the UK for implementing that English language proficiency testing for people who’re gonna stay a long time there; I think in the long run, it is way more beneficial than detrimental to a person. There are enough cultural and societal differences to overcome without throwing language into the mix too.
I'd bet dollars to donuts, if Thailand had a similar "language proficiency test" foreigners had to pass to secure yearly visas here; there'd be a LOT less foreigners living here than there are now. Plus the ones who’d live here could speak Thai to Thais; rather than rely on their Thai significant other for 'translation services'. It drives me up a wall hearing foreigners communicate in what I call "2-word-tourist-thai", or a moronic mix of thai-engrish or that "baby-talk-engrish" to their "thai-in-tow". It makes me sad, mostly for the Thai person, not so much for the foreigner.
Anyway, the topic of this post is "Are Thai girls really so bad in marriage?". I think the real question (which I will ask in an obtuse manner only) is; what particular "demographic" of Thai women are foreigners (who can't speak Thai) exposed to? If you're not working here either in an office or some business environment you're unlikely to have the opportunity to meet Thai women of that demographic. The language barrier is even a more effective "limiting factor" as far as a foreigner getting exposure to what I will call "real Thais". It's my experience after traveling this country from Trang to Tak, Nong Khai to Had Yai, Kanchanaburi to Chantaburi and places in between that you can hardly "pull" English outta these people with pliers; unless English is a necessary "skill set" so they can earn a living or do their job.
Educational, earning, and cultural disparities along with dissimilar "family values" which exist between here and other places are hard truths which hafta be faced. These things can and do factor into foreign misconception that Thai girls are "bad in marriage". These people are Thai; born, bred, and rice fed, that ain't gonna EVER change. They are firmly entrenched in their "Thai cultural values" and in a "Thai mindset" as those things have been pounded into their heads since they were kids. This "Thai culture" mentality can and does clash with cultural norms of "foreign countries" especially ones like the US, UK, EU, AU, etc.
I don’t have a Thai significant other, nor do I profess to have the answer to the topic of this thread. I'm only pointing out what I've witnessed first hand in regards to foreign/Thai relationships, the problems I've seen arise, and how things can go pear shaped or off the rails pretty darned fast.
My opinions are just that, my opinions. That you don't share them negates neither of our viewpoints on the subject. If anything it only highlights how different people can see the same thing differently.
Good luck (no really, I mean that sincerely, good luck!!). ..
Posted 22 February 2012 - 09:41 PM
It doesn't come over in an obtuse way to me, and even so, why beat around the bush, you're right... I'd been in Thailand a long time before I met my wife. I got through more than my share of women in that time, from all walks of life. Then, there was my wife...
Point is, without knowledge of the language and culture, the relationship would probably have floundered in seconds... Lucky for me, we got married. Crucially, my respect for Thai family values has underpinned my relationship with my wife's family. That's a game changer.
You have to wholly accept these values if you're to live in Thailand with a Thai woman... In fact, you have to accept and understand them even if you both marry/live in your own origin country. If not, you're just going to be finding fault, and excusing your own lack of flexibility and understanding by blaming everything on Thai people. We've had a lot of people like that come through OE's doors over the years.
Posted 23 February 2012 - 12:22 AM
To Asian people family come first and foremost and it is unfortunate that this is sadly missing in western society.
Posted 23 February 2012 - 03:35 AM
Posted 23 February 2012 - 08:32 AM
Posted 23 February 2012 - 09:59 PM
Posted 23 February 2012 - 10:58 PM
Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:04 PM
Same goes for Thai women niche websites (doubly so actually)... Only to be used as a first contact tool. You should be meeting them in person, over long periods of time, in the real world. The idea that a computer can programmatically match you to your ideal partner is a bit of a joke.
Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:06 PM
Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:07 PM
Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:12 PM
Posted 24 February 2012 - 04:33 AM
Posted 06 March 2012 - 05:54 PM
What do you mean with West? Caucasian men, or US-men or also Western females married with an Asian man?
****To answer long term relationship depends on the girl. Can be bar girl or regular and can work out . Could also not workout. I have been married 5 years no problem and have friends who have married a bar girl 6 years and reg girls and are still together.. Now question I have for you Yohan says you are based in Tokyo then how come all these posts to Thai site and what is your knoledge of Thailand?
Posted 06 March 2012 - 09:07 PM
Posted 06 March 2012 - 10:03 PM
Posted 07 March 2012 - 02:06 AM
Yes, I am living in Japan since over 30 years.
I am visiting Thailand (but have been also in other Asian countries) since 1972 regularly about 3 times a year for vacation (about 6 weeks a year) from Tokyo, I have 2 condo-units in Pattaya and Jomtien, Thai banking account and my small motorcycle, all ready for retirement.
I have been in all provinces of all Thailand by car, bus, train, motorcycle...
I am married since over 35 years, no problems, no bargirl, with grown-up daughters and forstergirl btw...
I am not posting only in the Thai section, I wrote many comments about Philippines, Japan and some other countries I know btw.
Posted 07 March 2012 - 03:23 AM
I asked him a question before and made a comment about Thailand and he informed me he lived in Japan. My knowledge of Thailand is from visiting 3--4 times a year since April 2000. Bought a 3 bedroom home in Chon Buri in 2005. Been married to my Thai wife for 6 years known her for almost 12. Brought friends over who later married Thai girls 1 lives in Thailand now the rest of us will retire there eventually. I will sell my house here in Boston Mass and move over this year. I have been all over Thailand from Phuket and Krabi, Phi Phi in the south to Chiang Mai , Chiang Rai in the north and many places in between. Have Thai friends who i met in USA and others i met while visiting Thailand. Have hi-so friends and farmers as friends.
Edited by กำนัน, 07 March 2012 - 05:54 AM.
Posted 07 March 2012 - 11:35 AM
This is really a long trip from Boston to Chonburi.
Luckily I am in a better position, as now Thai Airways is operating also from the Tokyo Haneda Airport, located in Southern Tokyo, only 15 minutes from my home... only about 5 hours in the airplane.
Should you ever settle down in Thailand, make sure a good part of your property/savings is outside of this country.
About myself and Japanese wife, we will never move totally away from Japan, but to be away from Tokyo after retirement for a few months during winter time and also especially during the hottest season (around August) is fine.
So we will be here and there a bit, as I said, for us it's not a long trip. My older daughter is living in HongKong, again a destination for us to visit. - Unfortunately I am not retired yet....
Posted 07 March 2012 - 11:41 AM
Posted 07 March 2012 - 12:03 PM
...They now sound like their western sisters
Might be that there are some women who are getting crazy about Western life-style, same here in Japan or China or elsewhere in Asia.
However Thai laws and Thai society are not much supportive to 'Western life-style' -
A Thai man is not bad off with the legal situation in Thailand.
The only problem I see is with dowry demands, this custom should be outlawed.
Anyway, if you are unwilling to pay, you might look for a Thai woman with children and there will be no dowry for sure.
There is no risk for a Thai man should he accept marriage and children including a relationship with bargirls.
Posted 07 March 2012 - 01:00 PM
My colleagues are not very very beautiful, but not ugly. General, they have pretty good looking, educated (half of them have Master degree, some others are doing thesis), independent and from good families.
Most of our customers or suppliers are surprised and don't believe that we don't you have boyfriend. Once, one of our long-term customer asked me and my Boss (a 54 year-old British guy who married with a charming Thai lady): "Why?".
My Boss's answer: I don't know. Maybe they work too hard and have no time for dating. Or maybe they expect too high. I got married with my wife when she was 40 and this is her first marriage. She's very excellent.
Then my answer is: both reasons are correct. If you ask every individual, they will tell you that they want to have boyfriend, they want to get married and want to have children. But they can not find a good guy. So they will continue to be single....till they can meet someone. Some of them have very bad experience with their ex-boyfriends (Thai guys). They told me most of Thai men are "chau xu" and request too high from a woman. I agree. My ex-hus is one of these guys.
Posted 07 March 2012 - 03:49 PM
Posted 07 March 2012 - 04:15 PM
Posted 07 March 2012 - 08:42 PM
28 ladies in my office.......The youngest is 28 years old. The oldest is 43 years old.
.....So they will continue to be single....till they can meet someone. Some of them have very bad experience with their ex-boyfriends (Thai guys)
There are 10000s of honest men from everywhere worldwide looking for a good female partner in Thailand, Vietnam and elsewhere in FE-Asian and SE-Asian countries, and if you tell me the YOUNGEST is already 28 years old, then it is clear, that all these single women are not interested into a long-term relationship with a man out of whatever reason.
If they don't want a Thai man, because of their preconception, they can easily look for contacts with men of other nationality.
Men are always outnumbering the women when looking for contacts and this often to a margin of 6:1.
Personally I would never consider to date a single woman who is already 43 years old - except a widow with children. -
What should this mean? A 43 old single woman, talking about how bad her Thai boyfriends have been in the past?
She spent her young time to make fun out of men and to have fun with men, and now when she is getting old and no man is interesting in dating her anymore, she is suddenly looking for somebody to be with her?
For sure, time is working for men, never for women. These women with such a narrow biased mindset against men will always be single.
It's up to them to remain single, their choice - but do not blame the men - including Thai men - for that.
I wonder, what is the definition of a 'good guy' for these women...
Education level plays a minor role I think, more significant is the upbringing of the girl and her behavior and expectations. If this is a girl with her single mother and the mother is running after men only for money and sex-fun, the daughter will become more or less the same in future.
I can only laugh when I hear women to complain, that exactly these few men they have chosen themselves out of 100s of available men are unfaithful. Their choice... better think about how to make a better choice in future.
Nowadays, young men frequently have a lower education level than women. These men are often single, they are doing all the hard, difficult and dirty work, they have good intention but earn little money - and their only choice is to pay for prostitutes.
Women with higher education will never look at them, just laughing. And there are many men with honest intention, but they are not rich, they cannot pay for all and everything, what women want. Who will accept a Thai man, earning baht 25.000,-?
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